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This Post Has 4 Comments
STEVE RAY HERE: To answer the charges below read my article:
https://www.catholicconvert.com/documents/QueenOfHeaven.pdf
I need to learn enough about my faith to be able to defend what I believe. There are so many out there that want to destroy Catholicism and pull Catholics away from their faith. What has spurred my interest today is a post from a Catholicism hater stating that God warned us in Jeremiah 7:17-20 not to honor Mary, that this verse “proves” God doesn’t want us honoring Mary the mother of our Lord. I have read and reread this and I don’t get where they get that out of it. Also they state that for 800 yrs the Catholic church kept the bible from the laity and that there were extreme punishments for having a bible. I stated that if it wasn’t for the Catholic church there would be no bible and that the reason everyone didn’t OWN one was because of the cost since the printing press wasn’t invented yet . They state back to me that I have been brain washed by the Church and that the Pope is the anti Christ…I’m ready to just drop out of the argument but yet I feel that others are being led by this misrepresentation and misinformed and that some how my posting my arguments even if I don’t change her mind perhaps others may delve deeper to find the truth.
Rhonda Koechig August 8, 2011 at 8:57 PM
Hi Rhonda, I’m very late finding this article. I was just relaxing, after work, perusing Steve’s fine website, when I stumbled upon it. Steve addressed it very well in his link. I hope you’re still checking back to see if anyone else has input.
You said:
I need to learn enough about my faith to be able to defend what I believe.
That is a beautiful attitude. We should also remember not to stress about it. Be thankful that so many Protestants CARE. Because I’m a fervent Catholic. And it drives me nuts, that so many of us, don’t seem to. Do you know what I mean?
There are so many out there that want to destroy Catholicism and pull Catholics away from their faith.
Been there, done that. I was an anti-Catholic for a great big part of my life. I was anti-Christian actually, as I was an atheist. But when I came back to Christ, the last Church that I ever thought I would attend, was the Catholic Church.
What has spurred my interest today is a post from a Catholicism hater stating that God warned us in Jeremiah 7:17-20 not to honor Mary, that this verse “proves” God doesn’t want us honoring Mary the mother of our Lord. I have read and reread this and I don’t get where they get that out of it.
Queen of Heaven. That is one of the titles we give Mary in the Catholic Church. See the link that Steve provided for an excellent explanation of why it was legitimately wrong in the Old Testament, and legitimately right in the New.
Also they state that for 800 yrs the Catholic church kept the bible from the laity
I would ask them, “Which 800 years was that?” Without going into too much detail, the fact is that the Catholic Church canonized the Old Testament and wrote the New Testament and then put both together in the Bible. Soooo….when and why would the Church then forbid the laity to use it? That doesn’t make sense.
and that there were extreme punishments for having a bible.
Hm? I think they forgot one word in that statement. For having a “false” bible. If you look in any bible history, you will find that many bibles were written which were not correctly interpreted. A good example today, would be the “New World Translation”, which is an error filled translation of the Bible.
And the only punishment of which I’m aware is to turn in the false bible and the Church would burn it. That’s it. You would lose out on whatever you paid for the error filled bible, the Church did not reimburse you.
I stated that if it wasn’t for the Catholic church there would be no bible and that the reason everyone didn’t OWN one was because of the cost since the printing press wasn’t invented yet .
EXCELLENT RESPONSE!
They state back to me that I have been brain washed by the Church
Yeah, I know. If I had a dime for everytime I’ve heard that one…… I reallly don’t know what to say to that. The only thing that I do say is this:
Hebrews 13:17
King James Version (KJV)
17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
That seems pretty clear to me. Their own Bible, the King James, says that we are SUPPOSE TO submit to and obey the Church.
The brainwashing part, I don’t know how to respond to that. I’m not brain washed. But the Bible tells me to submit to and obey the Church. Is that being brainwashed? If that is being brainwashed, then Scripture tells us to be brainwashed by the Church.
and that the Pope is the anti Christ
Really? Scripture says:
Matthew 16:18
King James Version (KJV)
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
And also:
John 21:17
King James Version (KJV)
17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.
I don’t see anything in Scripture saying that the Pope is the anti-Christ.
…I’m ready to just drop out of the argument but yet I feel that others are being led by this misrepresentation and misinformed and that some how my posting my arguments even if I don’t change her mind perhaps others may delve deeper to find the truth.
You’re right in both cases.
First. You have already posted a GREAT Catholic argument. The purported rebuttal can be recognized by reasonable people to be a “strawman” argument. In other words, a reasonable person can see that you are right and they are wrong. Therefore, there is no need for you to continue. Your response is sufficient.
Second. If you want to give an even more convincing argument, you certainly are free to do so. Please remember that your arguments are not the “source” ??? I don’t have the word. What I’m trying to say is that God gives the growth, we just plant and water. You can argue til you are blue in the face, but if the grace of God does not enter their soul, they will not convert. Therefore, many times, less is more.
Having said that, here is a supplemental argument from my own blog, In praise of Mary.
I hope that helps.
Sincerely,
De Maria
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